Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
Did you miss your activation email?
November 21, 2024, 09:36:13 PM
Home Help Search Login Register
News: Ceriatone Forums are up and running!!!
 
Guests please register
Note: If you want to help you can donate to keep the forums alive.



Do you want to advertise on this forum ? Send me a private message.



Amplified Parts
+  Ceriatone Forum
|-+  Ceriatone
| |-+  Overtone
| | |-+  How to get rid of some Stiffness
« previous next »
Pages: [1] 2 Go Down Print
Author Topic: How to get rid of some Stiffness  (Read 15650 times)
captainbackfire
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 113



View Profile
« on: September 25, 2012, 06:01:37 PM »

Hi! My OTS has been playing for a while and my G12-65 is factory broken in. I've been using a lot of settings and have found many good ones. One thing that sorta bothers me is stiffness with picking especially on clean.

Is this because im using JJ 6L6's?

Is this a symptom of high plate voltage? If so, can it be easily lowered then or something?

Does it take like 10 arena gigs for the rest of the components to break in?


Thanks guys! I thought this could spark some discussion to cure any stiff issues.
Nick
Logged
plasticvonaband
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 747


Pickin and Grinnin since 1989


View Profile WWW
« Reply #1 on: September 25, 2012, 10:26:08 PM »

where do you have your presence set?
Logged

Overdrive is like peanut butter. Some like it crunchy, some like it creamy.
Bluesmaster 50 2x12 combo and some guitars.
captainbackfire
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 113



View Profile
« Reply #2 on: September 26, 2012, 05:43:26 AM »

I like the prescence on 6-8  Smiley
Logged
plasticvonaband
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 747


Pickin and Grinnin since 1989


View Profile WWW
« Reply #3 on: September 26, 2012, 07:02:53 AM »

well, the more presence you add, the stiffer the response can be as well.
Logged

Overdrive is like peanut butter. Some like it crunchy, some like it creamy.
Bluesmaster 50 2x12 combo and some guitars.
captainbackfire
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 113



View Profile
« Reply #4 on: October 04, 2012, 05:12:04 AM »

Okay I now set it at around 5. I adjusted a couple of things (PI, checked dressing again) and I think the amp sounds noticeably better.

One thing my tech told me, the JJ 6L6's have fast attack or in other words stiff. What can you guys recommend to me that would make my amp more "touch responsive" as opposed to "stiff"?
Of course I like the sound very detailed and balanced as much as possible. I don't want excess mids but will make exceptions. I've been reading reviews on power tubes but in at the end of the day, I am more confused. Besides, you guys here know what tubes work for these amps. Thanks!
« Last Edit: October 04, 2012, 05:13:47 AM by captainbackfire » Logged
rane008
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 122


View Profile
« Reply #5 on: October 04, 2012, 04:20:56 PM »

Try TAD Power Tubes.  Either variety sounds great.  The 6L6GC-STR are like the old RCA 6L6s and the 6L6WGC-STR are like GEs from the 50s and 60s.  Good stuff and affordable.
Logged
plasticvonaband
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 747


Pickin and Grinnin since 1989


View Profile WWW
« Reply #6 on: October 04, 2012, 10:03:20 PM »

Try TAD Power Tubes.  Either variety sounds great.  The 6L6GC-STR are like the old RCA 6L6s and the 6L6WGC-STR are like GEs from the 50s and 60s.  Good stuff and affordable.


+1 on this. I switch to the TAD 6L6WGC-STR when i want a less stiffness than lower mids than the Tung Sols provide.
Logged

Overdrive is like peanut butter. Some like it crunchy, some like it creamy.
Bluesmaster 50 2x12 combo and some guitars.
captainbackfire
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 113



View Profile
« Reply #7 on: October 05, 2012, 01:37:47 PM »

Thanks you guys.

I've been reading Steve and Erwin's Bluesmaster Clean Mod from way back. Basically they pointed out that the OTS have an "in your face" attack emphasis which I agree on 100%.

They also made it clear that the mod (to BM clean) made the clean more responsive with natural compression/ sustain etc. It sounds totally my thing.

Now Bluesmaster owners, are these things true then? Cause if it is, then I'm pulling the trigger for a future BM clean mod. I also like the clean to have less mids, more bass and chime. But I don't particularly like the blackface analogy with the BM. I'd like to think the BM sounds bigger and more like a deep sounding Two Rock. BM clean should be more than just Blackface clean. Is it? If so, I really think BM is really my cup of tea for real then.


>>> I've been thinking about the BM clean thing for a while too but am baffled with the thought of modifying the guts extensively as I realize this is not a simple swap-the board mod. Nik said I should make a list of parts needed for the mod. But frankly I don't have the ability to discern which components should be swapped out if I want the amp to have BM clean but stock OTS non hrm drive. (BTW I like my OTS drive just as it is, though it could still improve on some things like cleaner bass and more overtones/ feedback). And btw the JM mod which they say now is standard on the BM's is such a sweet bonus for me.

So any thoughs /help would be greatly appreciated.

Does anybody have a layout of a Bluesmaster Clean non HRM OTS?

Thanks a lot,
Nico
Logged
captainbackfire
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 113



View Profile
« Reply #8 on: October 05, 2012, 02:10:32 PM »

I see. Maybe get a 50w Bluesmaster then? To save like 8 lbs? Would that be worth it?



Me, my main issue really is the fast in-your-face attack that I can't seem to tune out on my OTS.
I totally get the OTS mids and the g12 65 sound. What I can't seem to live with is the stiff attack. I also set my PI to about 7 volt more on pin 1. My speaker is broken in. I've discovered all the interplay with the controls. I settled with some tubes I like (except JJ's on the power which were there from start). I am also able to turn it up to about 3-4 master vol. There's this nagging stiffness that get in the way of my playing.
Logged
rane008
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 122


View Profile
« Reply #9 on: October 05, 2012, 04:40:38 PM »

Nico,

What you are asking is better put to the guys at the Amp Garage forum.  It seems to me that you are wanting BM cleans and classic Dumble OD.  There is an Dumble (I believe it's Larry Carlton's) that fits this bill.  It's called the Ripper.  You may want to check into that. 


Stephen
Logged
hotrodkid
Newbie
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 20


View Profile
« Reply #10 on: October 08, 2012, 11:39:01 PM »

I too was experiencing some stiffness and traced it right back to the speaker, a EVM12L. I tried a few other speakers in there since with much better results, a Kendrick Brownframe and a Jensen C12K. I settled on the Kendrick but at $180 shipped it's pricey. And good luck finding a used one. The Jensen C12K's pop up used on ebay for much less, but even new they are almost half the Kendrick. Both speakers were more earthy, less sterile and less stiff than the EV. IMO, whatever speaker you choose - I would keep it between 65-100 watts max, that is unless you're gonna be playing with the volume on 7+ for long periods of time. Fwiw, the Jensen gave the best blackface cleans.
Logged
212Mavguy
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 142


View Profile
« Reply #11 on: October 09, 2012, 12:01:47 PM »

Nico,

What you are asking is better put to the guys at the Amp Garage forum.  It seems to me that you are wanting BM cleans and classic Dumble OD.  There is an Dumble (I believe it's Larry Carlton's) that fits this bill.  It's called the Ripper.  You may want to check into that. 


Stephen

It's not a good idea to go to the amp garage as a Ceriatone owner asking questions about a Ceriatone D-clone, they'd prefer we do it here.  Enough folks over there are upset to where I'd recommend using the search function there first before asking questions, that's part of the rules anyway.  There's a sticky thread over there directed toward  Ceriatone SSS owners, for example.   And we do have a few of the more knowledgeable amp garage forum members here. 
Logged
captainbackfire
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Posts: 113



View Profile
« Reply #12 on: October 09, 2012, 01:53:25 PM »

Thanks for the help guys. I'm definitely getting ideas here and will update y'all for any luck getting rid of the fast attack feel.
Logged
hotrodkid
Newbie
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 20


View Profile
« Reply #13 on: October 09, 2012, 06:18:04 PM »

Even with the changes I made to mine it doesn't have the sag of like a Fender amp. It's seems the only way I can totally get past it is to run an od pedal with a decent amount of gain on the clean channel. I just think the amp doesn't compress well at lower volumes, when you turn it up it's fine which is most important. I'm done comparing this amp to others, it's so unique you can't. I'm setteled in with mine and I like it. Don't judge this amp at bedroom/home levels. It's a loud 50 watts but you have to find the venue to crank it up or it falls short. But using a speaker/speakers you can push a little does help it.

HRK
Logged
plasticvonaband
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Gender: Male
Posts: 747


Pickin and Grinnin since 1989


View Profile WWW
« Reply #14 on: October 09, 2012, 11:59:29 PM »

Thanks for the help guys. I'm definitely getting ideas here and will update y'all for any luck getting rid of the fast attack feel.
I guess you could try disconnecting the NFB, don't know if this makes the OTS terribly unstable and oscillate or not.
Logged

Overdrive is like peanut butter. Some like it crunchy, some like it creamy.
Bluesmaster 50 2x12 combo and some guitars.
Pages: [1] 2 Go Up Print 
« previous next »
Jump to:  


Login with username, password and session length

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.12 | SMF © 2006-2009, Simple Machines LLC Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!

CeriaTone Forum is not afiliated with Ceriatone Amplifications. The CeriaTone and name, logo and related trademarks and service marks, owned by CeriaTone. , are registered and/or used in the U.S. and many foreign countries. All other trademarks, service marks, and trade names referenced in this site are the property of their respective owners.