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Author Topic: EVM 12L Classic Speaker Question  (Read 19275 times)
hellomusic
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« on: December 08, 2011, 08:16:10 PM »
Hi,

I find that the EVM 12L Classic is rated at 200 W. But the OTS is only 50 W. Isn't the speaker too much for the amp to move Huh?
Just a newbie stupid question please.

Thanks for your time.
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Drpoyer
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« Reply #1 on: December 09, 2011, 03:23:56 AM »
The EVM is a popular speaker for the OTS because it is so much more speaker than the amps rating suggests.   Unlike jensens and Celestion the EVM does not impart as much colour to the tone as more traditional less efficient speakers.   The voice of the EVM speaker works for many. You can expect to  hear the amp, guitar and signal path without the artifacts of a lower wattage, less efficient speaker.   That may or may
not be for you but for many the compression and cone breakup it does not work as well with the OTS as the very efficient EVM.  The other go to speaker issues to be the Celestion 1265, this has more traditional Speaker qualities.   As for which is better, it is only a matter Of opinion.   I currently use WGS 1265 clones in an open back 2x12 and they breakup a bit at stage volume and are warm and not highly defined, but enough so as to cut the mix well.   
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wyatt
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« Reply #2 on: December 09, 2011, 03:39:29 AM »
Quote from: hellomusic on December 08, 2011, 08:16:10 PM
Hi,

I find that the EVM 12L Classic is rated at 200 W. But the OTS is only 50 W. Isn't the speaker too much for the amp to move Huh?
Just a newbie stupid question please.

Thanks for your time.



The speaker is rated *up to* 200 watts. That's the point at which it can be ruined. It doesn't have to see 200 watts.

Plus a 50-watt amp can peak at 80+ watts. A 50-watt Marshall for instance is usually exceeding 50-watts by "4" on the Volume knob
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hellomusic
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« Reply #3 on: December 10, 2011, 06:20:42 PM »
Thanks for the replies. Makes sense. If only they were not >200$ . I heard there are some eminence alternatives for the EV, but might as well wait and get the real deal.
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achim1
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« Reply #4 on: December 11, 2011, 10:11:01 AM »
>200 bucks? Try to get an older EVM 12L, with a little luck you can catch one for around 150 on ebay. I'm running my OTS 50 with a 2x12 cabinet, and a 1x12 Thiele cabinet. All with old EVM 12L's. The speaker are the real deal (for me)!
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rane008
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« Reply #5 on: December 12, 2011, 08:29:14 PM »
Agreed re price.  I have a 12-L and a 12-S and paid $100 each.  Both are used, but that's not a big deal for me.  Check CL or the Bay.
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Tone Control
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« Reply #6 on: December 18, 2011, 07:47:16 AM »
Quote from: hellomusic on December 10, 2011, 06:20:42 PM
Thanks for the replies. Makes sense. If only they were not >200$ . I heard there are some eminence alternatives for the EV, but might as well wait and get the real deal.

in the mean time, haul your amp round to try as many cabs/drivers as your can, there is no guarantee you will prefer an EVM12L
I have a BM HRM and had a Fuchs ODS and a Ceriatone OTS, I found my EVM12 a little shrill, there are other "clean" speakers around
Alledgedly, the Eminence Delta Pro 12A is a near-clone.

I have a Twin that runs into 2x Eminence ME12-1008LE
These are not as crisp, but are very cheap now - you can pick these up used on ebay so cheaply, I prefer some amps through these than through the EVM12
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Dr Tone Control, Strats mostly, prefer saturated clean tones, a little OD sometimes
BM50, JTM45, 36w EF86, DZ30, Expression, + non-Ceriatones (Matchless, Victoria, Wienbrock)
Just started with pedals a little after a 10 year purist spell, but usually just delay
achim1
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« Reply #7 on: December 18, 2011, 10:15:20 AM »
They might be a little shrill, thats right. I'm running my OTS 50 with 6L6 WGC tubes, very warm an "jazzy" sounding (think of John Mayer). This combination, EVM 12L and 6L6 WGC, seems to be "the deal" fpr me.
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Tone Control
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« Reply #8 on: December 18, 2011, 08:54:10 PM »
Quote from: achim1 on December 18, 2011, 10:15:20 AM
They might be a little shrill, thats right. I'm running my OTS 50 with 6L6 WGC tubes, very warm an "jazzy" sounding (think of John Mayer). This combination, EVM 12L and 6L6 WGC, seems to be "the deal" fpr me.

yep, it's all down to what works for each of us, therefore I recommend to anyone - try a loaned EVM12 and others rather than just saving up for an EVM12. The EVM12 will not be everyone's favourite
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Dr Tone Control, Strats mostly, prefer saturated clean tones, a little OD sometimes
BM50, JTM45, 36w EF86, DZ30, Expression, + non-Ceriatones (Matchless, Victoria, Wienbrock)
Just started with pedals a little after a 10 year purist spell, but usually just delay
Pickmaster
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« Reply #9 on: December 19, 2011, 11:48:39 AM »
Interesting thread. Usually most important things with the  speakers are how they work with different cabinets and HOW THEY RECORD / sound via PA. That’s how listeners hear them in a large halls or open filds.
Small club/pub gigs are different if you are not going through the PA, that’s why I always recommend to mice it up and put it through a little bit anyway, even small amount of sound via PA makes tremendous (good) difference. In this case EV12 is a best recording speaker so far.
Speakers which also record well are:
1.   Celestion Blue,
2.   Celestion Gold 12’’ and 10’’
3.   Celestion G12 K100
4.   Celestion G12 – 65
5.   Ceestion Vintage 30
6.   Fane AXA 12 alnico
7.   Jensen Tornado Neo
8.   Eminence Cannabis Rex
9.   Eminence deltalite II 2512 neo
10.   Eminence Raging Cajun 10’’

But still EV is a best!
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Tone Control
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« Reply #10 on: December 20, 2011, 10:08:59 AM »
Bookmark Dr Ika's list
This is the short list for any ots or hrm owners

The fane aka 12 is worth attention, whilst not as nice as a celestion gold to my ears, it's close, and is cheaper, and takes 100w, useful if you want a 100w Alnico 1x12

I found my favourites, Alnico speakers less appropriate for the OTS, and other rockier and brighter amps.
I love the alnicos on tweeds, the bluesmaster, matchless, vox, but not with train wreck, el84 se amps , jtm45, 70s, 80s twins, etc

Think about the beam too, mic and pa is the only way to be certain of getting your sound out there
I see more people using a transparent screen in front of the cab, to benefit even more

Btw Has everyone here heard of the doughnut-shaped beam blockers?
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Dr Tone Control, Strats mostly, prefer saturated clean tones, a little OD sometimes
BM50, JTM45, 36w EF86, DZ30, Expression, + non-Ceriatones (Matchless, Victoria, Wienbrock)
Just started with pedals a little after a 10 year purist spell, but usually just delay
hywelg
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« Reply #11 on: December 20, 2011, 10:24:21 AM »
Quote from: Tone Control on December 20, 2011, 10:08:59 AM

Btw Has everyone here heard of the doughnut-shaped beam blockers?

Yes indeed. I have them installed in 2 cabs and 2 combos. Cheap enough to 'suck it and see'. Just make sure if usingthe spray contact adhesive to let is dry a bit before attaching to the grille, that way if you wan to remove it it won't leave lots of foam bits sticking to the back of the grille.
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Pickmaster
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« Reply #12 on: December 20, 2011, 04:06:09 PM »
Jay Mitchell’s foam doughnut is a good directivity modifier. We have done loads of experimentation with it and found out that best way to use t is 15’’ foam disk with 3’’ hall in the centre. The best result achieved when disk is positioned 30-40 cm IN FRONT OF THE 12’’ speaker. Even better if you create a same foam 15’’ FUNNEL instead of disk, put it in front of the speaker on some kind of stand. It will not only block unwanted hi beam, it will redirect it all around depending on the funnel’s wall angle.
Much better idea than transparent Plexiglas screen.
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achim1
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« Reply #13 on: December 20, 2011, 06:24:02 PM »
Quote from: Pickmaster on December 20, 2011, 04:06:09 PM
Jay Mitchell’s foam doughnut is a good directivity modifier. We have done loads of experimentation with it and found out that best way to use t is 15’’ foam disk with 3’’ hall in the centre. The best result achieved when disk is positioned 30-40 cm IN FRONT OF THE 12’’ speaker. Even better if you create a same foam 15’’ FUNNEL instead of disk, put it in front of the speaker on some kind of stand. It will not only block unwanted hi beam, it will redirect it all around depending on the funnel’s wall angle.
Much better idea than transparent Plexiglas screen.

Could you please explain yourself? Are there some links, drawings or so?
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SoundPerf
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« Reply #14 on: December 20, 2011, 07:58:32 PM »
Quote from: achim1 on December 20, 2011, 06:24:02 PM
Quote from: Pickmaster on December 20, 2011, 04:06:09 PM
Jay Mitchell’s foam doughnut is a good directivity modifier. We have done loads of experimentation with it and found out that best way to use t is 15’’ foam disk with 3’’ hall in the centre. The best result achieved when disk is positioned 30-40 cm IN FRONT OF THE 12’’ speaker. Even better if you create a same foam 15’’ FUNNEL instead of disk, put it in front of the speaker on some kind of stand. It will not only block unwanted hi beam, it will redirect it all around depending on the funnel’s wall angle.
Much better idea than transparent Plexiglas screen.

Could you please explain yourself? Are there some links, drawings or so?

http://www.tgpwebzine.com/?page_id=424
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Chris

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