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Author Topic: Smartulator vs Verbrator  (Read 9276 times)
flexmachine
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« on: November 02, 2010, 11:41:11 AM »
Howdy,

did someone of you guys compare the smartulator against the Fuchs Verbrator?
I have a 50w Bluesmaster and want the smoothing effect. I don't need the reverb but heard it's really good (so why not?).

Do booth have a similar effect? How do the " drive" an bright switches on the smatulator do?

Thanks!
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exocet
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« Reply #1 on: November 02, 2010, 05:28:48 PM »
If you don't want the reverb then I think that Fuchs will sell the same thing minus reverb. I have verbrator and think that it's great both as a loop and a reverb unit. As I wanted reverb anyway it made sense. techically the Verbrator is similar to the C-Lator (Tube Cathode follower with Tube gain recovery) but it doesn't have a bright switch.

The only thing missing from the Verbrator that the C-Lator has is the Master output gain. As the OTS FX loop is driven 'post matster volume' not only is the reverb level dictated by the master volume setting, but you also can't crank the master to drive the Cathode follower hard without increasing the sound level produced by the amp. The C-Lator has it's own master which in effect becomes your overall master volume, you can then crank the amp master to get a nice compression from the C-Lator. I'm looking to fit a master to the Verbrator for this reason.
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bobgoblin
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« Reply #2 on: November 03, 2010, 01:57:34 AM »
I've got a Fuchs Tube-FX-Loop & a C-Lator, ran them both for a while, have run them separately as well.  They both sound great, but for effects that don't have internal parallel operation (like most pedals), the Fuchs is the way to go.  Since I don't use pedals anymore, and the rack effects I do use have internal parallel mixers, I only use the C-Lator now.  The Fuchs sits, collecting dust...
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Steven_nl
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« Reply #3 on: November 03, 2010, 08:09:08 AM »
I was wondering if there's any tonal difference between the two. I do feel the C-lator cuts a bit of top end (transparancy). I need to compensate by turning up my presence quite a bit.
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Emiel
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« Reply #4 on: November 03, 2010, 11:51:02 AM »
Bob, do you notice some difference sound-wise?

I like the Verbrator  it sure changes the amp sounds a bit, making it more balanced and less shrill. Only I just got this awful noise through the speakers when the Verbrator is on  Huh? sounds like a broken tube or so...
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Pickmaster
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« Reply #5 on: November 03, 2010, 03:27:06 PM »
Quote from: Emiel on November 03, 2010, 11:51:02 AM
Bob, do you notice some difference sound-wise?

I like the Verbrator  it sure changes the amp sounds a bit, making it more balanced and less shrill. Only I just got this awful noise through the speakers when the Verbrator is on  Huh? sounds like a broken tube or so...

Verbrator in a parallel mode should not change the tone at all !!!
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exocet
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« Reply #6 on: November 03, 2010, 08:05:19 PM »
Quote from: Pickmaster on November 03, 2010, 03:27:06 PM
Quote from: Emiel on November 03, 2010, 11:51:02 AM
Bob, do you notice some difference sound-wise?

I like the Verbrator  it sure changes the amp sounds a bit, making it more balanced and less shrill. Only I just got this awful noise through the speakers when the Verbrator is on  Huh? sounds like a broken tube or so...

Verbrator in a parallel mode should not change the tone at all !!!

The verbrator in parallel mode will change the tone because it's only the FX that are inserted into the send / return that are placed in Series or Parallel. Even in Parallel mode, the 'dry' signal from the OTS will pass through the Cathode Follower and Gain Makeup stage. Whether it's a dramatic change in tone.....that's a different thing and will depend upon how hard you drive it.
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Pickmaster
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« Reply #7 on: November 04, 2010, 02:18:26 PM »
Quote from: exocet on November 03, 2010, 08:05:19 PM
Quote from: Pickmaster on November 03, 2010, 03:27:06 PM
Quote from: Emiel on November 03, 2010, 11:51:02 AM
Bob, do you notice some difference sound-wise?

I like the Verbrator  it sure changes the amp sounds a bit, making it more balanced and less shrill. Only I just got this awful noise through the speakers when the Verbrator is on  Huh? sounds like a broken tube or so...

Verbrator in a parallel mode should not change the tone at all !!!

The verbrator in parallel mode will change the tone because it's only the FX that are inserted into the send / return that are placed in Series or Parallel. Even in Parallel mode, the 'dry' signal from the OTS will pass through the Cathode Follower and Gain Makeup stage. Whether it's a dramatic change in tone.....that's a different thing and will depend upon how hard you drive it.

No, it does not.
Properly built cathode follower should not change signal’s spectral character (tone). It can change signals amplitude (volume, gain) but well tuned Verbrator does not.
Before I bought one I’ve run it through this simple true bypass switching device (verbrator’s all dials must be on zero).

None of my amp’s (50W & 100W OTS And Bludo ) tone or volume changed within the range from 1 to 7 on amp’s  master.
After 7, signal gradually changes shape from sine to squareish.
I never use amps Master higher than 5 in live situations.
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exocet
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« Reply #8 on: November 04, 2010, 05:23:15 PM »
Quote from: Pickmaster on November 04, 2010, 02:18:26 PM
Quote from: exocet on November 03, 2010, 08:05:19 PM
Quote from: Pickmaster on November 03, 2010, 03:27:06 PM
Quote from: Emiel on November 03, 2010, 11:51:02 AM
Bob, do you notice some difference sound-wise?

I like the Verbrator  it sure changes the amp sounds a bit, making it more balanced and less shrill. Only I just got this awful noise through the speakers when the Verbrator is on  Huh? sounds like a broken tube or so...

Verbrator in a parallel mode should not change the tone at all !!!



The verbrator in parallel mode will change the tone because it's only the FX that are inserted into the send / return that are placed in Series or Parallel. Even in Parallel mode, the 'dry' signal from the OTS will pass through the Cathode Follower and Gain Makeup stage. Whether it's a dramatic change in tone.....that's a different thing and will depend upon how hard you drive it.

No, it does not.
Properly built cathode follower should not change signal’s spectral character (tone). It can change signals amplitude (volume, gain) but well tuned Verbrator does not.
Before I bought one I’ve run it through this simple true bypass switching device (verbrator’s all dials must be on zero).

None of my amp’s (50W & 100W OTS And Bludo ) tone or volume changed within the range from 1 to 7 on amp’s  master.
After 7, signal gradually changes shape from sine to squareish.
I never use amps Master higher than 5 in live situations.

I agree with you pickmaster, if you keep things at sensible levels then the verbrator is  transparent - I like it a lot. I was only trying to point out to others that the OTS has a serial FX loop and adding a verbrator or other 'loop' type device will force the signal to pass through it even if it offers a parallel mode. I probably should have phrased that differently!!!

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bobgoblin
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« Reply #9 on: November 05, 2010, 04:52:12 PM »
Quote from: Emiel on November 03, 2010, 11:51:02 AM
Bob, do you notice some difference sound-wise?

I like the Verbrator  it sure changes the amp sounds a bit, making it more balanced and less shrill. Only I just got this awful noise through the speakers when the Verbrator is on  Huh? sounds like a broken tube or so...

Emiel, this is difficult to answer because the C-lator now functions as my "global" master volume, and the Fuchs did not work in that capacity.  With the Fuchs, I only ever used it in parallel mode, so the volume knob on the Fuchs controlled only the amount of effect added to my signal.  With the C-lator (which is a series only function) I control the amount of effects through parameters within the rack unit while the In/Out/Drive & bright switches work in conjunction with my amp's features to shape my overall tone.
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