Ceriatone Forum

i recently swapped the original JJ preamp tubes in OTS for Electro Harmonix 12ax7's.... i must say the difference is remarkable!!!!!, my strat is more musical, in both the clean and dirty channels. but the dirty channel now chimes more and nails the mayer/SRV tones very well. my 335 now gets a tone close to greg allman/dicky betts.

i have ordered some reissue mullards now to see if there is any further improvement. in comparison, the jj's sounded a little dark, but did have more gain.

i wonder is anyone else has experimented with different preamp tube brands? i'd love to hear some opinions

thanks... i hear the tung sols are toppy

Doesn't the OTS have a cathode follower on the V2?  If it does, I have heard that the TS-RIs will not be able to handle the current.  That comes from one of the guys at tubedepot.com, but I could be wrong about that.

Thanks, Tonequest.  Good info.

Any use any of the TAD "telefunken" 12ax7 clones?

Yes I do; 7025 high grade selected, one of the best new production tubes around!

Hi ToneQuest:

I think I use these: http://www.tubeampdoctor.com/product_info.php?cPath=21_60_63&products_id=390 (http://www.tubeampdoctor.com/product_info.php?cPath=21_60_63&products_id=390)

I don't care what the recomendations are; they are v1 and PI in my OTS and fender amps.

The OTS doesn't have a cathode follower at v2. For other amps; I never tried them in a cathode follower/recovery triode setup.

Don't mind the sales pitches on the TAD website.
Only thing I noticed they don't draw much current so the plate voltage is higher in comparison to a JJ ECC83.

after some more experimentation i have found the following:

clarity in the amp is dependent in V1 and v3
overdrive tone is dependent on V2 (of course)

jj's in V1 and V3 (one or both) sound dark and you lose a lot of top end, however the gain is higher

so far i have found EH's sound better in V1 and V3 with jj for V2

this gives enough gain and beef whilst the other 2 take care of passing the signal transparently

i'll provide an update when i get my mullards

i like tungsols in all positions, but i like the overdrive even more with the old RCA i have in there, much fatter. IMO the JJ's in V3 kill the harmonics and bloom and in V1 it makes the clean channel lifeless.

JJ's are now only used as test tubes by me due to their ruggedness

Don't underestimate the importance of Power Tubes either. I'm using Tung Sol 5881's now. They sound nice but I'm not sure sure they can handle the 450V for a long period of time.

I have JJ's in V1 and V2 and a Sovtek LPS in V3

great to hear... i'll have to try tung sols....

anyway, Today I received the mullard 12ax7's

They are broad spectrum and aggressive.

After swapping all combinations of valves i found the following:

Mullard for V1: just drives the preamp harder. Drives the clean channel to break up. Its aggressive sound is perfect to drive V2 stage.
JJ for V2: it’s the best for V2 as its warmth and midrange is better for the OD
Mullard or EH for V3: mullard better for rock or more edgy blues, its got more output and drives the output tubes harder the overall tone is more agressive. EH gives a sweeter tone in general, and is probably better for blues or jazz (a little tamer)

Mullard definitely has a much higher gain (gm) as they run hotter than the EH and the JJ.

I'll provide an update once I have run these in for a while in this config.


i wonder if anyone else has used these new reissue mullards....????

i have the schematic of the HRM and the V2 section is definitely not cathode follower. so there would be no problem using whetever tuve suits your ears in that position

i am curently writing a manual for the HRM. i offered this to nik so that he can focus on doing what he does best, building great amps for all of us. the first draft has already been commented on by nik and after a few more revisions, i will post it for all and sundry. i will include a technical section with,schematics,  tables of correct voltages and biasing instructions as well.

i also plan to include some settings as well as the basis for getting certain tones etc.

Hey Mr. Fabulous,

A manual would be great!  So many questions out there.  Could you link it up here when you're done (or before :), hehe).

Looking forward to it!

Stephen

yes of course i will link it up here too (with nik's permission of course)

fab

Thanks for taking the time to write the manual.....I have a 100wHRM on order, and I have gathered from the forum that there are specific control settings that allow the player to get the most from this amazing sounding amp.  Will you announce when the manual will be available?

yes of course
i did some more work on it last night, adding stuff Nik suggested
it will still be a week or so.....and i want to get Nik's ok on it too.

bear in mind... the settings will vary as well depending on the guitar you use with it...the amp reacts vastly different to different types of pickups.

the Kleinulator also affects the tone as well; even without effects units plugged into it

Look forward to it, mate :) Any extra info is always good.

Thanks
Rog

can't thank you enough in advance for this manual!!!!

guys,
this will in some ways be a living document...... your input once released will make it really superb.

this is the difference between buying a Ceriatone vs one of the main brands, we deal with the owner and we also have direct input

this community of people sharing their knowledge and experience is what makes Ceriatone special (and of course the amps are very special as well).

i am working on some basic setting at the monent upon which to build the sounds, afterwhich i will devote a section of using the effects loop and the effects loop buffer

then a technical section with layouts, and schematics


.... a good overall reference document designed to get people up and running and to develop a good understanding of the amp and its abilities.

I recently ran on to a handfull of good vintage 12AX7s from the 50s & 60s. I have 2 RCA long gray plates, a Raytheon black plate, and a really nice Sylvania 7025. I also got a pair of Siemens EL34s from the 70s.

I have to say that I am now a beleiver in vintage tubes. With all of the old AX7s there is more harmonic content & responsiveness than any of the JJ, EH or Tung Sol stuff I tried. There is an exceptional quality to all the old tubes I tried that new production just can't emulate.

In V1, the RCAs have a very rich sound but a little less detail than the Sylvania or Raytheon. They have a warmth & and almost touchable quality when run clean. 

The Raytheon is very detailed and airy. Very clear sounding with a nice even tonal response. Not as rich as the RCAs. Very responsive tube as well.

The Sylvania is right in between the other two in richness with a little more forward midrange. Excellent OD tone. There is so much detail, even with the drive at max, that every note in a chord rings clearly and remains listenable. This is a quality that new production tubes do not have at all.

I found that my favorite tube set up is an RCA in V1, awith the Sylvania in V2 and a Tung Sol in the PI. Of course the NOS Siemens/RFT EL34s help a great deal.

Everyone's taste is different but I highly suggest trying some good vintage preamp tubes. Not everyone will hear things the way I do. Some different RCAs, Sylvanias & Raytheons may sound different as well but they still all out performed the dozen or more new production tubes that I have on hand.