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Author Topic: bright cap on master or on bright switch  (Read 11088 times)
Steven_nl
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« on: February 15, 2010, 09:56:47 AM »
Hi guys
Is there a difference in sound between a bright cap on the master and using the bright switch (with the same value bright cap)?

I use a Dumbleator (made by Erwin). A Dumblator takes away some of the brightness. I used to compensate by turning up the Presence, but I felt this added some unwanted "attack".
Lately I experimented with the bright swicth a bit (which is 120 pF I think). This sounds pretty good actually. (need to turn down the treble of course)

So now I'm contemplating 2 options
- a push pull with a 64 pF cap
- changing the bright switch into a 3 way switch with a choise between 64 and 120 pF

any views on this?
Cheers
Steven
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mcinku
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« Reply #1 on: February 15, 2010, 10:36:37 AM »
As I see it... both caps act the same... more you turn up the pot (MV or Volume ) less effect the cap has.

So for me, the best way is to have 3way bright switch so you can select the value which works for you in a given situation. ... I use 47p and 100p on the switch and I use 15p on the MV.
With all those in place I can always find the brightness I like.

 Wink
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Steven_nl
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« Reply #2 on: March 03, 2010, 01:46:34 PM »
OK I solved this one.

This is for use with a Dumblator type of fx loop and the May 2008 layout of the OTS

Erwin put a 3 way bright switch (120 and 68 pF) in my OTS. He also put in a Push Pull Master Volume with a 47pF cap.

In my setup the 47Pf didn't do much. There was a bit of a difference if you listened real close (I had the impression string seperation was a bit better) but the tonal difference was (to) small.  Then he replaced the cap on the master with a 68pF cap.
This sounds a lot better. This solution adds some brightness to the sound making the overall color less bland and it takes away the "blanket over the speaker". It feels like the tone is broader. Obviously the OD sound becomes a bit brighter as well but you can compensate with Presence and higher volume.

If you compare it to the 68pF cap on the bright switch, The MV option sounds a lot better.
The bright switch makes the sound thinner and it adds a bit if a nasty color/edge to the tone. It's usable, but it's like an effect.

So, if you use an fx loop (kleinulator or Dumbleator) my advise is put a cap on the master and experiment a bit with the right value.

Mind you certain OTS's are bright allready.


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fabien
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« Reply #3 on: February 16, 2011, 11:33:12 PM »
Sorry to revive this old thread but I too had the feeling that my OTS 50 was a tad on the dark side.

At home it sounds perfect but with the band at rehearshal or gig it lacks a bit of sparkle and the treble and presence are already at around 8.
By experience I know that my Boogie F50 sounds bright and harsh at home so I turn the treble down but at practice or gig I'm lost in the mix and I bring those treble back up and lower the bass.

So today I bought some 68pf and 47pf caps and tried them, with aligator clips to be able to swap them easily.

68 pf was too much especially on the OD that got to fuzzy.

47pf was much better. With the treble and presence back to 6, the clean channel is chimier and by turning down the tone on the guitar I can get close to the tone without the cap. The OD channel gets a little edgier, somewhat more aggressive, the picking more so than the sustain. Overall the amp sounds a bit less mid heavy.

So I soldered the 47pf in the amp and closed it back. Let's see what it does at band practice. I might have a push pull MV pot put in there for more flexibility if I like the tone.

I use a 2x12 cab with Emi Swamp Thangs and those speakers aren't very bright but well balanced and open, I like those very much. As a comparison, playing on the G12-65 I used to bring the treble from 8 back to 6, and even lower with the Emi Tonker. The amp might be too bright for those now. Haven't tried yet.

Cheers
Fabien
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exocet
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« Reply #4 on: February 17, 2011, 07:26:34 AM »
Quote from: fabien on February 16, 2011, 11:33:12 PM
Sorry to revive this old thread but I too had the feeling that my OTS 50 was a tad on the dark side.

At home it sounds perfect but with the band at rehearshal or gig it lacks a bit of sparkle and the treble and presence are already at around 8.
By experience I know that my Boogie F50 sounds bright and harsh at home so I turn the treble down but at practice or gig I'm lost in the mix and I bring those treble back up and lower the bass.

So today I bought some 68pf and 47pf caps and tried them, with aligator clips to be able to swap them easily.

68 pf was too much especially on the OD that got to fuzzy.

47pf was much better. With the treble and presence back to 6, the clean channel is chimier and by turning down the tone on the guitar I can get close to the tone without the cap. The OD channel gets a little edgier, somewhat more aggressive, the picking more so than the sustain. Overall the amp sounds a bit less mid heavy.

So I soldered the 47pf in the amp and closed it back. Let's see what it does at band practice. I might have a push pull MV pot put in there for more flexibility if I like the tone.

I use a 2x12 cab with Emi Swamp Thangs and those speakers aren't very bright but well balanced and open, I like those very much. As a comparison, playing on the G12-65 I used to bring the treble from 8 back to 6, and even lower with the Emi Tonker. The amp might be too bright for those now. Haven't tried yet.

Cheers
Fabien



The higher you turn the master volume, the less impact the capacitor will have.
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fabien
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« Reply #5 on: February 17, 2011, 02:34:46 PM »
This is true but in this setup, or any setup with Dumbleator the master will be set at about 5 or 6, more than that and you'll fry your FX. At this level the treble bleed still has an effect.

On a guitar the effect stops around 9.
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Steven_nl
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« Reply #6 on: February 17, 2011, 03:01:50 PM »
Yeah I want to replace my 68pf cap with a 47pf as well. Hopefully that will be the last mod.
;-)
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fabien
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« Reply #7 on: February 18, 2011, 09:07:02 AM »
Quote from: Steven_nl on February 17, 2011, 03:01:50 PM
Hopefully that will be the last mod.
;-)

Ha! Guitarist's humour!... Wanna bet?... Grin
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Steven_nl
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« Reply #8 on: February 18, 2011, 09:22:03 AM »
How many guitars do you need?....Just one more
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bluesfendermanblues
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« Reply #9 on: February 18, 2011, 09:50:36 AM »
Quote from: Steven_nl on February 18, 2011, 09:22:03 AM
How many guitars do you need?....Just one more

More humor  Grin Cool
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fabien
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« Reply #10 on: February 18, 2011, 03:17:27 PM »
Do I need one more guitar? No.

Do I want one more guitar? YESSSSS! Chair Dance

Errr... why only one more? Cool
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